When I learned that two of my favorite blogging construction lawyers had teamed up for an innovative startup, I jumped at the opportunity to interview them. The post was scheduled to go live on AEC Quality .com in October 2012, but Chris and Doug asked me to postpone it for a few weeks as they wrapped up quality control on their software. A few weeks turned into several months as I dealt with some medical issues. Finally, after so much time, I am proud to present my interview with the co-founders of ClaimKit.
Chris Cheatham is a successful construction lawyer, perhaps most well-known for his groundbreaking blog, Green Building Law Update. Douglas Reiser is also a successful construction lawyer and blogger (The Builders Counsel Blog), and additionally performs the admirable service of offering legal counsel to breweries (The Brewery Law Blog). Together, they have created ClaimKit, an online service for organizing and managing documents associated with legal claims.
Q: Why Law? And why construction law, in particular?
Chris: I chose law for one reason – I like to solve problems. The attorneys I worked with before law school solved problems and I wanted to be like them. Construction and surety law was a natural fit because I preferred problems that I could see and touch. Other types of law, like constitutional law or patent law, focus on ideas. But a construction project can be seen and walked. You can hold blueprints in your hands (or view them on a computer screen!). You can talk to the key players that worked a construction project. I love the stories behind every single construction project. And I love untangling those stories to get to the truth and help clients resolve their claims or litigation.
As my legal career progressed, I started to become frustrated by the process of untangling stories that arise from a construction project. When you are looking back at a construction project that went bad, you have to rely in part (often in large part) on the documents. But the documents I received as an attorney were a complete mess. A great mentor of mine challenged me to find a solution to the construction document mess. So I started poking around and realized that there were two problems: (1) documents were being collected and stored in a haphazard manner; and (2) there was no real software solution for storing claim documents.
Like I said, I like to solve problems. So I set out to find a solution to the two problems.
Doug: I would echo much of what Chris said about its tangibility. I sweat away most of my summers and school breaks on the construction site. I took pride in creating something with my hands, and ensuring its quality and safety.
I knew that construction law would be an organic fit from the beginning of law school. Once I began navigating real live construction law, I realized that there were an abundance of slow and costly processes that could be improved. I helped co-found Express Lien (now ZLien) in those first few years out of school, while I watched many other legal tasks become automated, simplified and altogether improved. Many lawyers don’t get excited about losing billable hours to automation – I am not one of those lawyers. Construction, perhaps, stands to benefit the most from technology and I wanted to help bring that transition to fruition.
Q: Why the interest in green building law?
Chris: One day, I was sitting in my law firm and I had one of those “Oh wow!” moments. At that moment, I realized that I was working with a hundred other construction and surety attorneys. How the heck was I going to distinguish myself from the rest of them so that customers would hire me for their claims and litigation? I started thinking about valuable information that I could deliver to our customers free of charge. Around that time, in 2008, green buildings were just gaining steam. I started poking around about the legal implications of green buildings and realized there was very little commentary by attorneys. So I launched Green Building Law Update to dissect emerging legal and regulatory green building trends.
Doug: Green building is a no brainer for any advocate of construction. Smarter construction saves money, decreases environmental impact and improves lives. I was an advocate for its uniform adoption across the US, and so it became a part of what I do for my clients. From non-profit organizations down to solar subcontractors, I have had the pleasure of representing some of the best innovators out there.
Q: How Did You Two Meet?
Chris: I was two weeks out from a big green building legal conference, and my co-presenter canceled. I knew Doug had written about green building law on his legal blog, The Builders Counsel. Doug agreed to fly down to New Orleans and present with me. I remember him referring to me as a nerd because I was wearing pants instead of jeans. We ended up hanging out a bunch and grabbing a beer at one of his favorite New Orleans joints.
Doug: Chris gave me an excellent opportunity to return to my favorite city on earth – and former home – New Orleans. Our co-presentation was a wonderful thought-provoking experience that inevitably taught us that we had similar goals about the practice of law and the construction industry. Since that time, we have discussed big ideas over beers in Kansas City and Seattle.
Q: What is the specific problem that ClaimKit solves?
ClaimKit solves the problem of messy claim files, which means a lot of things.
Messy claim files might occur because documents are collected from the contractor in a haphazard manner, resulting in no organization for the end user. We solve that problem.
Messy claim files might occur because someone has to collect tons of electronic data and they have no idea how to locate what they need. We solve that problem.
Messy claim files might occur because the claim professional lack effective technology collect, organize and review claim documents. We solve that problem.
Q: What is different about ClaimKit from other service providers?
Chris: There are two key differences between ClaimKit and our competition — our domain expertise and our simple solutions.
We are construction and surety professionals, which means we understand construction documents and data. My father, Bill Cheatham is the Chairman of ClaimKit. He worked in the surety industry for 40 years and ran Zurich Surety for the last ten. I litigated on behalf of some of the largest construction firms and sureties against the federal government. Believe me when I tell you I know messy claim files. And Doug litigated on behalf of construction firms against other contractors and sureties. I love his fresh perspective because we were basically on opposite sides of the construction and surety law spectrum.
We are also deeply focused on delivering simple solutions. In the construction industry, there is a wide gap between those who like technology and those who don’t. We are trying to bridge that gap by delivering simple technology solutions. I like to test our solutions with what I call “the Dad test.” When we have a solution in place, I plunk my dad down in front of a computer and make sure he can use it. If he gets it, others will get it (no offense Dad!).
The eDiscovery world is a complete mess. Most eDiscovery projects are run like the Wizard of Oz. There is a curtain up between the attorneys and the eDiscovery professionals. The attorneys don’t understand what the eDiscovery professionals are doing or the associated costs; and the eDiscovery professionals don’t understand what the attorneys need or how to explain what they are doing in laymen’s terms. We have simplified the convoluted world of eDiscovery into a three step process – collect the data, remove the crud that you don’t need, and make the relevant documents available to the attorneys for review. And our software is simple enough for anyone to use.
Q: Will ClaimKit be available in all 50 states?
ClaimKit is available in all 50 states. We scan documents and collect electronic data anywhere, anytime. In fact, we can be onsite in 48 hours. And we guarantee organized claim files. Our software is web-based so anyone can access it anywhere in the world. All you need is internet and you have access to your claim documents.
Walk us through the typical engagement that you envision.
I will describe a little claim and a big claim, because we do both.
On a little claim, a claim handler logs into DocKit, our web-based claim system. The claim handler creates a new file for a contractor and uploads the claim notice. The claim handler then sends a document request – through DocKit – to the contractor for any files related to the claim. The contractor receives the request, and logs into a secure page to upload files or request assistance with scanning its and electronic data. The claim handler can then review the documents to determine liability. Consultants, accountants and attorneys can also be quickly added to the system and invited to review documents. As the claim professionals are reviewing documents they can label documents or annotate documents (via an electronic post it note).
On a big claim, all three of our offerings come into play – document scanning, electronic data collection and filtering, and delivering the organized files in DocKit.
Our customer, the surety, initiates an investigation of multiple claims arising from one contractor. The contractor makes 50 boxes of documents available. We work with the claim team to identify what needs to be scanned. Then we scan and upload the electronic documents to the claim document system.
Next, we collect all of the electronic data that the contractor had created over the last seven years. Because the claim team does not want to review over 2 million electronic documents, we work with the attorneys and accountants to create filters so that we can eliminate the data that did not need to be reviewed. Once we have a manageable set of electronic documents, we put them up in the web-based application.
Our secret sauce is DocKit. With DocKit, we can collect tremendous amounts of documents and data (we recently did 50 gigabytes) and deliver it in an organized fashion.
Honestly, we created the solution I wish I had when I was a construction attorney.
Q: Does ClaimKit provide tangible benefits to parties involved in “Right To Repair” disputes?
In California, under our “right to repair” laws, codified under Sections 896, et al., more commonly known as SB800, builders have a 30-day window in which to perform certain tasks in order to enjoy the protection of those statutes. Chief among the requirements is the production of documents including plans, specifications, grading plans, soils reports, Dept. of Real Estate reports, engineering calculations, maintenance records/recommendations, warranty/maintenance docs for manufactured products, and the builder’s warranty documentation. Not only is producing these documents challenging within a 30 day period, but so is making sure that certain documents are not produced. Would ClaimKit potentially benefit builders involved in SB800 claims?
Absolutely. In fact, I would love to test out our system with a California builder.
I see a few components to the SB800 production that seem tricky for a contractor. I like to focus on solving problems (remember?) so here goes.
The SB800 documents are stored in multiple formats in multiple locations.
The DocKit system has a very easy upload document feature. So documents can be uploaded from any computer no matter where they are stored. And a contractor could always email or mail the documents to the ClaimKit team and we could make sure the documents are properly uploaded and organized.
The SB800 documents have to be labeled when you produce them in accordance with what the law requires.
The DocKit system allows a contractor to “tag” a document after it has been uploaded. So the contractor could label the plans as “Plans” and the soil reports as “Soil Reports.” Later on, the contractor can go back and show the other side exactly what was produced.
Like you mentioned, how do you make sure you don’t produce too much?
This is a great question and it really comes down to the user. We can’t really ensure that a user uploads the correct documents. But by relying specifically on a document management system for claim scenarios, hopefully a contractor will be more cognizant of what is being made available to the other side.
After the contractor uploads and tags documents, the other side can be instantly granted access to the specific project documents.
Make sense? I would love to deliver on one these claim scenarios so please reach out to me if you are interested.
Q: What types of claims will ClaimKit serve as a benefit?
ClaimKit basically benefits any claim scenario where more than one person is involved.
And yes, that is every single type of claim.
Q: What has the response been so far?
The response has been extremely positive. My favorite response so far from a surety claim executive: “I like this a lot.” My second favorite response from a claim handler: “This is cool.” People just want simple technology that works and that is what we are delivering. Because we took a lot of time to figure out the claim process and the life of a claim document, we really believe we have nailed DocKit.
Conclusion
Thanks again to Chris and Doug for participating in this interview.
I encourage you to visit ClaimKit.com to learn more about their service. And be sure to check out the blog, which is updated regularly and serves as an excellent resource for legal, insurance and construction professionals alike.
About Chris Cheatham
Prior to launching ClaimKit, Chris dredged through claim documents on a daily basis as a construction attorney in Washington D.C. He has worked at some of the largest law firms in the country for some of the biggest companies in the world.
Chris is also a LEED Accredited Professional and has advised numerous companies regarding green building and renewable energy risks and contracts. He is also a frequent speaker for private companies, public agencies, associations and groups on the topic of green building risk mitigation.
About Douglas Reiser
Doug is a business attorney and LEED Accredited Professional focusing on green building, construction and alcoholic beverage law. He has experience in the legal arenas of New York, Cleveland, New Orleans, and Seattle, providing services to both private firms and government entities. He is a former member of Wolfe Law Group, LLC, and in 2010, opened Reiser Legal PLLC to focus on the everyday needs of businesses.
Doug is licensed in the states of Louisiana and Washington. He is an active member of the Washington Bar Association, serving as Chairman of the WSBA Young Lawyers Division’s NLE Focus Group and as a member of WSBA’s Continuing Legal Education Committee.
Image courtesy frammfoto
The post Interview With the Founders of ClaimKit: “A Simple, Turnkey Solution For Managing Claim Files” appeared first on More From Less and was written by Brian L. Hill.